Ron Reigns:
Welcome, and thank you for joining us on Birth Mother Matters in Adoption with Kelly Rourke-Scarry and me, Ron Reigns, where we delve into the issues of adoption from every angle of the adoption triad.
Speaker 1:
Do what’s best for your kid and for yourself, because if you can’t take care of yourself, you’re definitely not going to be able to take care of that kid and that’s not fair.
Speaker 2:
I know that my daughter would be well taken care of with them.
Speaker 3:
Don’t have an abortion, give this child a chance.
Speaker 4:
All I could think about was needing to save my son.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
My name is Kelly Rourke-Scarry. I’m the executive director, president and co-founder of Building Arizona Families adoption agency, the Donna K. Evans Foundation and creator of the You Before Me campaign. I have a bachelor’s degree in family studies and human development and a master’s degree in education with an emphasis in school counseling. I was adopted at the age of three days, born to a teen birth mother, raised in a closed adoption and reunited with my birth mother in 2007. I have worked in the adoption field for over 15 years.
Ron Reigns:
I’m Ron Reigns. I’ve worked in radio since 1999. I was the co-host of two successful morning shows in Prescott, Arizona. Now I work for my wife, who’s an adoption attorney, and I’m able to combine these two great passions and share them on this podcast.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
One Topic that is pretty prevalent it right now in the media, in the news, talking with people, I think even around the dinner table is how COVID-19 coronavirus is impacting abortions.
Ron Reigns:
It’s on both sides. Everybody’s using this as a political football.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
Correct. I wonder if this is a precursor to the upcoming election, that is, we’re getting closer and closer in the middle of the virus outbreak when you’re supposed to be under a state home order. Did you see on the news, I think it was in Wisconsin or Minnesota, where there were lines for the preliminaries of people lined up to vote?
Ron Reigns:
I didn’t see it, but I did hear that people were showing up to vote and that it was kind of surprising because you know, you’re getting into a crowd all of a sudden
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
Right? And some of those people weren’t wearing masks. And I’m thinking, I wonder in that state, if there’s going to be an influx of cases following. So that will be an interesting thing to see. Hopefully not, hopefully it’ll be fine.
Ron Reigns:
Definitely.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
So hopefully everybody listening is staying safe, staying home, staying healthy and following the orders of the state you’re residing in and obviously of the president. So, today I really want to discuss, and I want to make this a two part series, because there’s so much to delve into that I don’t want to be restricted by just having to get this into one podcast. I think that every time, Ron, you and I speak about abortions and how they’re being impacted and how the perception of this new law or an introduction of this new law is, is coming into play. I think that you and I are very, very vested in what we’re talking about. And I think we’re very animated and really want to express our feelings so that partners can really get the perspective that we’re trying to portray. And we hopefully are portraying.
Ron Reigns:
I hope so. I hope it’s getting across.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
I hope so too. So some of these headlines are absolutely blowing me away.
Ron Reigns:
I mean, it’s easy to tell when you read these headlines, which perspective the writer is coming from.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
100%. So the one that, we’re going to go over a few, but the one that really grabbed me and I have to say, I read it probably, no lie, 10 times. Then I grabbed a couple of my kids and I even read it to them because I was so shell shocked. Newsmax had a headline that states, Planned Parenthood gets aborted by COVID 19.
Ron Reigns:
It’s powerful. That’s quite an attention grabbing headline for sure.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
And what’s so interesting to me is the factual basis behind it.
Ron Reigns:
Yeah.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
I almost have no words. It’s one of those headlines that it’s enough. You don’t even need to have a story.
Ron Reigns:
It’s like, okay, I understand exactly what the perspective and where this story is coming from, just from the headline. Certainly.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
Right. And the author of this could have very well turned it into the paper and said, here you go.
Ron Reigns:
Done, thanks.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
Here’s my article.
Ron Reigns:
Here’s my six word article.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
But it’s all encompassing. So what was one that really grabbed you?
Ron Reigns:
It just fascinated me the different perspectives. You can obviously tell what the person’s heart is telling them to write. For instance, the coronavirus becomes an excuse to restrict abortions from the New York Times. I think that just, again, says everything that the author of the article is trying to say, just in the headline. You don’t need to go further to go, what’s this guy’s point of view? And it’s kind of shocking on both sides to some degree. Like I said, it’s become a real political football.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
It has. And it’s astounding to me that you would take two completely sensitive subjects and, in my opinion, both pandemics.
Ron Reigns:
Absolutely.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
And you’re putting them in the same category and yet using them to play off of each other. And it’s so twisted in so many levels when you’re trying to offset one by the other.
Ron Reigns:
It makes me think of, and I don’t remember who said it, it could have been Rama Manuel, but it was something along the lines of, never let a good crisis go to waste. In other words, use that to your political advantage and to get your politics past and I find it kind of icky, that’s my personal opinion. Because when I think of COVID 19 or abortion, for that matter, I think, okay, let’s get this problem solved and not try and use it to get other things done, and that’s what it seems to be they’re doing.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
I totally agree with you. I think when we agendize one thing and creep in another, I absolutely agree with you. I think that in this circumstance, and we’ve stated this over and over again, I’m pro-life, you’re pro-life.
Ron Reigns:
Right.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
So we are coming at it from that stance. I think it’s always fair to remind our listeners that, yes, openly we are pro-life. So understanding that, that is the perspective we are coming from. However, I think we’re both able to step back and at least explore and try to understand the other side, even if we do disagree with it.
Ron Reigns:
I totally agree. I love hearing a good debate from both sides, a respectful, not just shouting match, but two people who actually are actively listening to each other and their differences.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
And they’re educated in in the topic.
Ron Reigns:
Right.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
Life News had a headline that I think is paramount. And I think it’s one that anytime a topic regarding abortion and COVID 19 are brought together should be remembered. And there’s was coronavirus and abortion both are pandemics that kill people. That is a fact.
Ron Reigns:
Absolutely. I don’t think there’s even a question about it.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
But what you stated was true. When the Los Angeles Times stated that Republicans exploit coronavirus to restrict abortions. That’s not the case at all. We’re not agendizing as a Republican to exploit anything.
Ron Reigns:
Right. We’re looking at the headlines.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
Yes, yes, absolutely. I think that Forbes’ statement, their headline of states using COVID 19 to ban abortion increases everybody’s risks and hardships in a crisis. I have to say that this, although is an attention grabber, is incorrect.
Ron Reigns:
It’s the opposite of the actual truth.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
Right.
Ron Reigns:
Because abortions are hurting babies when they’re being, they’re killing babies when they’re being performed. So [crosstalk 00:09:00] stopping that actually is saving lives.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
Correct. It’s doing the exact opposite. Agreed. And then in podcast number two, we’re going to talk a lot about Texas because a lot has happened in Texas, but The Hill had a headline that said Texas women forced to travel 20 times farther for abortion under coronavirus ban. So now we’re talking about the length of travel. I guess, right now, in everybody’s world across United States, the coronavirus is impacting, affecting, killing people. It’s a huge, huge change. I mean two months ago, I would’ve never in a million years believed that we would be where we are today.
Ron Reigns:
Right.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
You and I are respecting the social distancing and doing this through Zoom, because we are trying to practice what we preach. So, I think that the fact that we’re worrying about accessibility to abortions is so far down the list right now of what we as a country should be focusing on.
Ron Reigns:
Right.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
The unemployment rate right now is at an all time high. People are waiting on their stimulus checks. They’re waiting on unemployment benefits. People are being impacted left and right. Again, we believe that pregnancy and the birth of a baby is a blessing. And now we’re reading a headline that women are or forced to travel to further to receive an abortion. It’s just not-
Ron Reigns:
Oh, no, it’s more inconvenient to go out and kill your baby.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
Right. So, looking at facts, just hardcore facts. President Trump, for insured coronavirus relief funds, can’t go to abortions. I commend him for that.
Ron Reigns:
And this is part of the hide law, right?
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
Yes. So any healthcare funding that does not have the hide protections could potentially be used to fund abortion. President Trump ensured the coronavirus virus bill passed with high protection and tax so that money can be used to combat the pandemic of the coronavirus and not fund abortion. We need to prioritize saving lives, not destroying them. Each year, nearly 1 million women choose to end a pregnancy in the United States. And about one quarter of American women will use abortion services by 45 years of age. We’ve stated this statistic before, and it’s still mind blowing. Even though every time I see it and I think about it, it really does blow my mind. It’s so, I don’t want to use the word common, but I don’t know what other word to substitute that with.
Ron Reigns:
Accepted, maybe. I mean, it’s just so normalized. Like it’s no big deal and-
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
Maybe desensitized.
Ron Reigns:
Right. Yeah, there you go. Like when you go out in public, do you ever look at a group of four women and go, one of them, statistically speaking, has had an abortion.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
Because I research this now, maybe. I have four daughters and I can’t imagine.
Ron Reigns:
Any one of them.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
That happening, any of them doing that. That would be beyond devastating. And having four girls, that statistic hits me really hard, because I hope and pray that that never happens. Hopefully it won’t. I mean, it’s something that we’re very loud about in our household.
Ron Reigns:
Yeah. Very vocal.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
And it’s something that we have instilled in our children since they were infants. Approximately 70,000 people seek abortion care in the U.S. every month. That’s 70,000 babies.
Ron Reigns:
That’s the size of a small town. Very small town, but small town. You know?
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
Yeah. It is a size of a small town.
Ron Reigns:
And that’s every month you said?
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
Yeah, every month. These numbers, the reason that we’re reviewing them is because we want to show our listeners how critical it is for the United States, citizens, and anybody who understands abortion, and the three choices, parenting, adoption, abortion, understands the impact of abortion. We’ve said before, how many doctors, how many Pulitzer Prize winners, how many people that turned out like Gandhi, have we aborted?
Ron Reigns:
Right. World leaders, people who impact life and society and the world. Right.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
And so it’s absolutely, mind-boggling.
Ron Reigns:
The American College of Obstetricians and Gynecologists and other reproductive health professional organization issued an unequivocal statement on March 18th, 2020, that they do not support COVID 19 responses that cancel or delay abortion procedures. On Monday, the 6th of March, representatives of over 30,000 physicians who practice according to The Hippocratic Oath and American Association of Pro-life Obstetricians and Gynecologists, the American College of Pediatricians, Christian Medical and Dental Associations and the Catholic Medical Association and the Association of American Physicians and Surgeons released a statement to end elective abortions during the coronavirus emergency.
Ron Reigns:
So you’ve got, again, both sides using this coronavirus to try and push their agenda one way or another. Although, and I guess it comes back to what you believe as a person, if you think that abortion is a right that should not be infringed or you shouldn’t have to go twice the distance to get to an abortion clinic or whatever, you’re going to side on that side of it. But I think more importantly, right now we should focus on the COVID 19 and say, you know what, let’s stop the abortions for now. That is not what is vital to the American society. We’ll pick that back up later. We need to deal with the COVID 19 right now. Right. But again, that pushes my side of the agenda to, so I’m not trying to be a hypocrite here.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
No, I completely agree with what you’re saying and thank you for in depth reading the statement that was released.
Ron Reigns:
Well, thank you for researching it. I appreciate it.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
Lets… Yeah, absolutely. All right, so taking a step back, let’s look strictly at the numbers [crosstalk 00:16:19] of the COVID 19 global pandemic. Now, I want to preface this, stating this, the numbers that we’re giving were actually researched two days ago. So, obviously they are higher. Secondly, I want to state that I am in no way minimizing the impact, the effect or any aspect of COVID 19. I am absolutely personally terrified of COVID 19. I think that the president is doing everything right, and I think that he is really doing the best that he can with the knowledge that he has. I think that this is a very scary time for not just United States, but the entire world. But because we are discussing abortions, I do want to do a compare and contrast with numbers so that people can see our concern regarding abortion.
Ron Reigns:
Okay. Very good.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
To date, the approximate global deaths attributed or resulting from COVID 19 is 114,215. To date, the approximate U.S. deaths attributed to, or resulting from COVID 19, is 22,071. Now, if we go back to what we stated earlier, around 70,000 people seek abortion care every month.
Ron Reigns:
Every single month. So, over three times as many deaths caused by abortion in the same amount of time essentially, as have been caused in the United States by COVID 19.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
That’s correct.
Ron Reigns:
Okay.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
So that being said, I think that we 100% agree, recognize, support that COVID 19 is 100% a pandemic.
Ron Reigns:
Without doubt.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
When we get a hold of COVID 19 and we re-secure our health and, hats off to all of the frontline healthcare, and everybody becomes safe again, at that point, my hope and prayer, is that we will then look at another pandemic, which is abortion. There are two other very viable options. With the coronavirus COVID 19, there’s not another option. You can’t say, oh, no, I’d rather have the flu. No, thank you. No, thank you.
Ron Reigns:
It would be nice, but we can’t do that.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
It’s not like the common cold, the flu or the coronavirus. You don’t have three options.
Ron Reigns:
Right.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
When you have an unplanned pregnancy, you can choose to parent, you can choose to place that child for adoption, or you can choose abortion. So you don’t get a choice.
Ron Reigns:
Even with that, there’s other options. People have family members that are able to, and I guess that would be kind of an adoption situation as well. But there are other options that are very viable to just ending and terminating this life. The little one’s life, as we said, fetus means little one, and that’s what you’re doing. You’re ending their potential future.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
When you are faced with an unplanned pregnancy, again, remember, you have three options and that’s why we as a society right now should be focusing on COVID 19. We really should because there are not three options. And I think that in order of priority, I absolutely get it because everybody who is choosing to have an abortion can choose to make another choice. With COVID 19, again, there’s no other choice, you can’t say, oh, no, no, no, I’m going for the common cold, or I’m going for the flu. I’m going for this, or I’m going for that. You don’t get that option.
Ron Reigns:
Right.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
And there’s so much unknown. And so I think that it’s really important that we step back and really, really look at abortions and what they really are and what they entail and how they impact the healthcare community.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
And we are actually seeing that more and more. We’re going to talk about that in the second episode about how they are impacting right now, the healthcare and the depletion of vital medical supplies that are needed and how states are trying to combat that and intervene. So to close this podcast, I would really like for people to step back for those that are pro-choice, for those that do believe in the right to choose an abortion, to really contemplate to what degree. If you have somebody who is needing a ventilator and a nurse to wear a clean mask, a to have clean gloves and clean gown, and it is imperative that they have those to keep, not only themselves safe, but to keep their patients safe and depleting those supplies, because somebody else wants to choose to terminate the life of a baby is unfathomable to me.
Ron Reigns:
Does it kind of seem to you that not only is it making this worse, it’s doubling the impact, because not only could you lose a life from the COVID 19, you are absolutely going to lose a life due to the abortion. So now you’re doubling your costs.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
Presuming the abortion is successful.
Ron Reigns:
Right.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
So hopefully our listeners are going to take away from this, how important it is to understand and be educated in what you believe and what you preach. And I think that hopefully everybody is going to continue to follow the rules and regulations as issued by the government and the state you live in and stay home, stay safe and be healthy.
Ron Reigns:
This is from a letter that was penned by a group of pro-life organizations, including the American Association of Pro-life Obstetricians and Gynecologists, the American College of Pediatricians, Christian Medical and Dental Associations, the Catholic Medical Association, and the Association of American Physicians and Surgeons. Now, I’m directly quoting from this letter. It says, in a recent joint statement, ACOG with several other traditionally pro-abortion medical organizations made the preposterous claim that abortion is an essential component of comprehensive healthcare for women, even though elective abortion treats no disease process. Furthermore, over 85% of practicing obstetricians and gynecologists do not perform elective abortions. If elective abortion were an essential component of women’s healthcare, it would be a part of every obstetric and gynecologic practice. Currently, across the United States, services that do not constitute essential healthcare for women, including routine pap, smears, mammograms, and pelvic exams are being postponed in order to reduce everyone’s risk of exposure to COVID 19 and to conserve scarce medical resources.
Ron Reigns:
Dr. Christina Francis recently exposed ACOG’s transformation into a politicized pro-abortion organization in the Wall Street Journal. ACOG spinning elective abortion into essential healthcare is more of the same. Continuing to perform elective abortions during a pandemic is medically irresponsible. Elective abortion is neither essential, nor urgent, but it does consume critical resources, such as masks, gloves, and other personal protective equipment and unnecessarily exposes patients and physicians to pathogens. Elective abortion, both and drug induced, also generates more patients to be seen in already overburdened emergency rooms. Most abortion providers instruct women to go to an emergency room if they have any concerning symptoms after the abortion. Approximately 5% of women who undergo medical abortions will require evaluation in an emergency room, most commonly for hemorrhage. Surgical abortions can also result in hemorrhage. Emergency room personnel who are already struggling to meet the demands of the COVID 19 pandemic will further be strained to provide care for these women. This letter goes on to call for all elective abortions to be suspended in accordance with the CDC recommendations pertaining to elective procedures and office for visits.
Ron Reigns:
Thanks for joining us on Birth Mother Matters in Adoption. Tune in next time, and we’ll continue our discussion of COVID 19 and its impact on adoption, especially when it comes to abortion. If you’re pregnant and considering adoption in Arizona, Building Arizona Families is a licensed, full service, nonprofit Arizona adoption agency. They believe in adoption after care services and have a program on site to provide continued support through the Donna K. Evans Foundation. You can contact them at (623) 695-4112 anytime of the day. And you can find Building Arizona Families online at azpregnancyhelp.com. We also have a new website for this podcast at birthmothermatterspodcast.com. Remember to rate and review us wherever you’re listening to this podcast. And as always for Kelly Rourke-Scarry, I’m Ron Reigns, and we’ll see you next time on Birth Mother Matters in Adoption.