Ron Reigns:
Welcome, and thank you for joining us on Birth Mother Matters in Adoption, with Kelly Rourke-Scarry, and me, Ron Reigns where we delve into the issues of adoption from every angle of the adoption triad.

Speaker 2:
Do what’s best for your kid and for yourself. Because if you can’t take care of yourself, you’re definitely not going to be able to take care of that kid, and that’s not fair.

Speaker 4:
And I know that my daughter will be well taken care of with them.

Speaker 5:
Don’t have an abortion. Give this child a chance.

Speaker 6:
All I could think about was needing to save my son.

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
My name is Kelly Rourke-Scarry, I am the executive director, president and co-founder of Building Arizona Families adoption agency, the Donna Kay Evans Foundation, and creator of the You Before Me campaign. I have a bachelor’s degree in family studies and human development, and a master’s degree in education, with an emphasis in school counseling. I was adopted at the age of three days, born to a teen birth mother, raised in a closed adoption, and reunited with my birth mother in 2007. I have worked in the adoption field for over 15 years.

Ron Reigns:
And I’m Ron Reigns. I’ve worked in radio since 1999, I was the cohost of two successful morning shows in Prescott, Arizona. Now I work for my wife who’s an adoption attorney, and I’m able to combine these two great passions and share them on this podcast.

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
There are so many reasons why people adopt.

Ron Reigns:
Such as?

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
95% of people who adopt, do so, according to statistics, because of issues with fertility.

Ron Reigns:
So, that is the vast majority of-

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
Yes, that is the vast majority. So, people will say, then who has infertility? Studies show us that one in eight couples, or 12% of married women, have trouble getting pregnant or sustaining a pregnancy, according to the CDC. Approximately one third of infertility is attributed to the female partner, one third to the male, and one third is caused by a combination of problems in both, or is unexplained. Approximately 44% of women with infertility have sought medical assistance. Of those who seek medical intervention, approximately 65% give birth.

Ron Reigns:
That’s impressive, actually.

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
That is impressive, I agree with you. I think that those are good odds. However, what do you have to do to achieve those odds? Other reasons that people adopt are to protect their health, maybe they have a medical issues like heart conditions or epilepsy, and a doctor may suggest that pregnancy may not be a good idea for you having that particular medical disorder.

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
Maybe you love caring for children, and you just want to provide a good life for a child, and it’s just in your heart. Some people adopt because they believe in balancing population growth. Others to avoid passing down genetic disorders or diseases, if it runs in their family. Some women have had difficulties in previous pregnancies, and so to avoid pregnancy complications, they choose adoption. Some are maybe a single mom or a single dad, and they want to start a family. If you’re in a same sex relationship and you want to become parents, that’s another reason that people adopt. Sometimes people want to help pregnant women who are wanting to choose adoption to pursue their own life goals, and they adopt because of that. They may know somebody who is placing their child for adoption and decide that adoption is the right choice for them.

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
So there’s lots of different reasons. Another one is sometimes, and as an agency we don’t allow gender preferences, but sometimes people will choose adoption because they do want a particular, certain sex. So, either want a male or a female child. And we don’t allow gender preferences.

Ron Reigns:
Okay, so, the way you have it set up, is you get what you get?

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
No, we don’t allow gender preferences with Building Arizona Families. We used to, and what we’ve found is that ultrasounds are not 100% accurate.

Ron Reigns:
Right, so there’s bound to be disappointments in that as well.

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
As well. Plus, when we have women come into our adoption program, half of the women, ultrasounds show us, are having a girl, and half are having a boy. And the program was getting bottle-necked, because most people who adopt prefer a girl. And so, it was bottle-necking our program. And then the other third don’t know what they’re having when they come in, and so, again, it wasn’t working. Also, with gender preferences, when you are biologically having a baby, you don’t get to choose the gender. And it’s just not something that we felt comfortable going forward with as an agency.

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
There are lots of reasons to adopt. I know that when people come into our program and they are struggling with fertility issues, they will come in and say they have tried this road to becoming parents, and it didn’t work out, and so they are now choosing adoption. And adoption should never be looked at as a last resort to becoming a parent. The adoption process has more potential for success than infertility treatments, because there’s so many options within adoption. And medically, if there is a medical issue that is preventing you from being able to become pregnant or sustain a pregnancy, that’s something that is not a hindrance when you’re doing an adoption.

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
So people adopt for various reasons, but when you are struggling with a fertility issue, it’s important to resolve those issues before you go on to adopt, so that you don’t carry any resentment, or bitterness, or anger, or sadness, or guilt-

Ron Reigns:
To the child.

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
Not even just to the child, even to the birth mother, or the adoption process. Because, if your goal at the end of the day, and at the end of your journey, is to become a mom, then rather than focusing on the path it takes to get you to the end of the rainbow, if you will, I think it’s more important to focus on the end result, rather than which road you take to get there. It’s important when you are trying to become a parent, to remember the little things, and be present in the moment. And whatever journey you’re on, it’s your journey. It’s what is going to be part of your life story. And if you are so focused on the fact that you were not able to biologically have a child, even with fertility treatments, and that’s really upsetting and hard, then give yourself time to grieve that.

Ron Reigns:
Or you won’t appreciate the other part of this, the adoption aspect of this journey. Okay.

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
Adoption is also a beautiful choice. And it may not have been the road that you thought you were going to take, and it may not have been your dream, but when one door closes, another one can open. And you have to believe in that, and you have to believe that there is a reason and a purpose for what you’re doing.

Ron Reigns:
I think in speaking with hundreds and hundreds of adoptive families, before, during, and after their adoption journey, what I’ve learned from them, is that they were put in a place in their life that they didn’t expect to be in. Growing up, their dreams may or may not have included adoption. And if they hadn’t, and they got married, and they realized that becoming pregnant, carrying a child, was not a possibility, then adoption is a door that opened. Rather than focusing on the closed doors, focusing on the open doors is a way of looking at the glass as half full.

Ron Reigns:
When you change your mindset and you look at adoption as a gift and an opportunity, you can be in the moment and you can see the forest for the trees, and the forest, you can see both. And I think that’s one thing that as a society we’re missing. And as adoption education and awareness becomes more prevalent, and a bigger part of what we teach in schools and in society, and we look at differently, and as celebrities come forward and share their adoption stories and make it more common, we’re not so sensitized to adoption and it becomes more normal, it becomes a more natural way of life.

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
Right, you’re shining a light on this beautiful situation, right?

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
Yeah. I think the more we do that, and the more we celebrate adoption, and the more we look at it as another way to build a family, I think that more reasons why people adopt will surface. I think it won’t just be a default choice for parents who can’t have a child the way that they originally had planned on having a child.

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
One thing that I think is important to note, is when you have chosen adoption, choosing adoption for the right reasons is paramount. If you feel called by your church or by some other avenue, and you’re doing it because you feel like you’re supposed to, that’s not a reason to adopt.

Ron Reigns:
Right. You should do it because that’s the journey you want to and need to be on.

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
Right. We’re talking about the life of a human being in a child, that doesn’t get to make the same choice as you. And that being said, it’s important to do adoption for the right reasons. That is one of the reasons during the home study, we’ve talked about this before, I know, in previous podcasts, we have to do individual interviews, with both the husband and the wife, to make sure that everybody is on the same page, and that nobody is feeling pressured into adopting by somebody else in the family. It’s really interesting too, when you’re doing a home study, and you’re talking with people about why they’re wanting to adopt, and about their feelings on children and parenting, you hear some very interesting comments made by a spouse about another spouse, and it comes across instantly, if there is any hesitation or two people not being on the same page, where they want their life story to go.

Ron Reigns:
Now, how often, as you do these types of interviews with the potential adopting parents, do you say, “No, we won’t support you in this, we’re not going to help you.” Does that happen?

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
It does. It’s rare. It’s really rare. Most of the time when they get to the home study, at that point, they’re solidified and they’re both on the same page. It does happen, but it’s not common at all. What we see is really common, is everyone’s pretty nervous. And usually you’re just trying to keep the wife calmed down and the husband from running out the door. You know what I mean? It’s more, everybody’s just got their nerves, and fight or flight. He’s flying out the door, and she’s just sitting there a bundle of nerves, because they don’t want to say the wrong thing and portray something that they’re not. And that’s not why-

Ron Reigns:
And I think we’ve all been in a situation where we feel that way.

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
And my whole life and my whole future family is-

Ron Reigns:
Hinged on this-

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
Right on this moment-

Ron Reigns:
Yeah, on this little linchpin.

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
And so I want to make sure I say the right things. And that’s not what home study providers and social workers are looking for.

Ron Reigns:
Right, they’re not sitting there inspecting you and looking for a chink in the armor.

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
There’s no white glove, where we’re dusting the top of your entertainment center. And there’s no box that we’re looking to check, as soon as you say something, we’re going to check the box and get up and walk out. It’s-

Ron Reigns:
“Thank you. It’s been nice. Have a nice day.”

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
“You’ll get my report in a week.” Yeah, no, it’s nothing like that. It’s really to just make sure that you meet the criteria to adopt. And one thing that birth mothers can rest assured in, is that when pre-adoptive families come in and they’re doing their home study, they are opening up their lives to be looked at by another entity, to prove how badly they want to be parents. And I will have birth mothers that come to me and say, “Have they been fingerprinted?” And absolutely, they’ve been fingerprinted, they’ve been background checked.

Ron Reigns:
They have been vetted.

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
Completely, completely. And that’s really important for birth parents to know, because they want to make sure that their child is going into a home, they can’t themselves provide. And that’s an important aspect.

Desiree:
My name is Desiree. I am 26 years old. When I first found out I was pregnant, it was unbelievable. I had just had my son last year, Alonzo, and it was a rough pregnancy as it was. And I came here first, and my first instinct was adoption, and two weeks later I removed myself from the program, because I was convinced by others to keep my unborn child. And then, reality started sinking in even more. I started getting more sick, and the father of the baby decided not to be a part, and I was absolutely left alone. I left the adoption agency for about two, three weeks, and then I called them back to keep going forward with this adoption. This is not a joke. You come and you meet these people that are willing to, not only help you in your time where you’re at your lowest, but they’re there to help you better the life for your child. You are a blessing to these adoptive parents, more than you will ever know.

Desiree:
In reality, you are giving your child to these people who, they have open arms and open hearts for your kid. In the end, this whole experience is going to change you, but they have people who are going to help you through this, so you are not alone.

Ron Reigns:
Tell me Again About the Night I was Born, by Jamie Lee Curtis and illustrated by Laura Cornell.

Ron Reigns:
“Tell me again about the night I was born. Tell me how you and daddy were curled up like spoons and Daddy was snoring. Tell me again how the phone ring in the middle of the night and they told you I was born. Tell me how you screamed. Tell me again how you called Granny and Grandpa right away, but they didn’t hear the phone because they sleep like logs. Tell me again how you got on an airplane with my baby bag and flew to get me, and how there was no movie-

Speaker 8:
What?

Ron Reigns:
Only peanuts.

Speaker 8:
Okay, I like peanuts.

Ron Reigns:
Tell me again how you couldn’t grow a baby in your tummy, so another woman, who was too young to take care of me, was growing me, and she would be my birth mother and you would adopt me and be my parents.

Ron Reigns:
Tell me again how you held hands all the way to the hospital, and when you got there you both got very quiet and felt very small. Tell me again about the first time you saw me through the nursery window, and how you couldn’t believe something so small could make you smile so big. Tell me again how tiny and perfect I was. Tell me again about the first time you held me in your arms and you called me your baby sweet. Tell me again how you cried happy tears. Tell me again how you carried me like a China doll all the way home, and how you glared at anyone who sneezed.

Ron Reigns:
Tell me again about my first bottle, and how I liked it so much. Tell me again about my first diaper change, and how I didn’t like it at all. Tell me again about the first night you were my daddy, and you told me about baseball being the perfect game, like your daddy told you. Tell me again about the first night you were my mommy, and you sang the lullaby your mommy sang to you. Tell me again about our first night as a family. Mommy, Daddy, tell me again about the night I was born.

Ron Reigns:
We have a pregnancy crisis hotline available 24 seven by phone or text at (623) 695-4112 or you can call our toll free number, 1800-340-9665, we can make an immediate appointment with you to get you to a safe place, provide food and clothing, and started on creating an Arizona Adoption plan, or give you more information. You can check out our blogs on our website at azpregnancyhelp.com. Thank you for joining us on Birth Mother Matters and Adoption, written and produced by Kelly Rourke-Scarry, and edited by me, Ron Reigns. If you enjoy this podcast, rate and review us wherever you listen to podcasts, and as always, thanks to Grapes for letting us use their song I Dunno as our theme song. Join us next time for Birth Mother Matters in Adoption. For Kelly Rourke-Scarry, I’m Ron Reigns, and we’ll see you then.